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From Santiago Gala <sg...@hisitech.com>
Subject Re: Jetspeed2 and MVC idea
Date Wed, 29 Oct 2003 08:23:13 GMT

El viernes, 24 octu, 2003, a las 22:16 Europe/Madrid, Weaver, Scott 
escribió:

>> Wow.  So you are saying that if you want to do MVC style development 
>> that
>> you _should not_ use Jetspeed 2? Ok.
>
> No.  The MVC model is not provided by the portal, it is not the domain 
> of the portal!  This is the current problem with J1, it is all bundled 
> together, which handcuffs the end developer from doing what she/he 
> really wants to plus I t generally makes everything a mess.
>
> Portlet applications are separate from the portal.  Portlets SHOULD 
> NOT rely on the portal for anything outside of what the spec provides. 
>  I don't think it wise for us to try and recreate a web application 
> framework when there are so many out there.
>
> We could eventually write a specialized MVC framework like the current 
> one in J1 that could hook directly into the Portal's functionality.  
> However, that is not as important right now.  Plus it would make the 
> portlets non-portable.
>

Agreed. Just to point that a specialized MVC framework like this one 
can be kept as a subproject of jetspeed2, specially if we have portlet 
applications depending heavily on it that will be ported from jetspeed 
1.



> Also, if we wanted to publish common services for portlets to consume 
> it would have to be done in manner were those commons services can 
> easily be ported to other containers.  I think this type of 
> functionality is desirable, but again it is not at the top of the > list.
>

This is an interesting area. This is, IMO, where turbine shines in 
comparison with other webapp frameworks.

> What is the domain of the portal?
> - profiling
> - personalization
> - navigation
> - security
> - page aggregation
> - request dispatching
> - standardized presentation through themes and skinning
> - handling WSRP based portlets
> - (possibly) inter-portlet communication
>
> You are more than welcome to expand on any/all of these.  By all means 
> submit formal proposals and I will commit them to the CVS.
>

+1

>
> Regards,
> *================================*
> | Scott T Weaver                 |
> | <weaver@apache.org>            |
> | Apache Jetspeed Portal Project |
> | Apache Pluto Portlet Container |
> *================================*
>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Todd Kuebler [mailto:tkuebler@cisco.com]
>> Sent: Friday, October 24, 2003 3:14 PM
>> To: Jetspeed Developers List
>> Subject: Re: Jetspeed2 and MVC idea
>>
>>
>> Wow.  So you are saying that if you want to do MVC style development 
>> that
>> you _should not_ use Jetspeed 2? Ok.
>>
>>
>> -tk
>>
>>
>> At 08:43 PM 10/23/2003 -0700, David Le Strat wrote:
>>> Todd,
>>>
>>> What about using Struts or JSF as your Portlet MVC
>>> model? Looks like the Struts team is working with a
>>> Struts version compatible with JSR168 and the final
>>> release of JSF should be compatible as well.
>>>
>>> Regards,
>>>
>>> David.
>>>
>>> --- Todd Kuebler <tkuebler@cisco.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> I continue to believe that the Portlet idea in
>>>> practice should simply
>>>> implement the controller paradigm of the MVC instead
>>>> of being some class
>>>> that needs extending by the typical web developer
>>>> just to create a html
>>>> fragment.  Just like servlets are best served by
>>>> something like Struts, I
>>>> believe portlets are best served by something like
>>>> the MVCPorlet
>>>> idea.   There should be a config file that ties
>>>> actions/events to views,
>>>> which the controller (portlet) uses to render it's
>>>> fragment.
>>>>
>>>> Maybe the J2 core doesn't deal with that, only
>>>> providing a container for
>>>> JSR 168, but as a portal implementation it will have
>>>> to deal with this idea
>>>> sooner or later to reach maturity imho since web
>>>> applications are almost
>>>> universally seeking the MVC paradigm going forward.
>>>>
>>>> Thoughts?
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> %regards -tk
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
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>>>
>>>
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>>
>>
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