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From Greg Stein <>
Subject Re: Whimsy general@ subs check (was: [DISCUSS] introduce "[DISCUSS]" threads for podling non-ASF release candidates)
Date Fri, 01 Mar 2019 15:20:17 GMT
On Fri, Mar 1, 2019 at 9:04 AM Lars Francke <> wrote:

> On Fri, Mar 1, 2019 at 3:05 PM Greg Stein <> wrote:
> > On Fri, Mar 1, 2019 at 7:00 AM Lars Francke <>
> > wrote:
> > >...
> >
> > > As far as I know every member can become IPMC member. So if we change
> the
> > > rules that every member vote is binding (whether or not they are in the
> > > IPMC) people wouldn't need to join the club.
> > >
> >
> > The legal structure passes through the IPMC. Members are irrelevant in
> this
> > scenario.
> >
> I'm not sure I understand. But either way I don't believe members are
> irrelevant. Looking at the Incubator site[1] it says "Foundation members
> may willingly join the IPMC at any time, [...]" and if they do only to vote
> but not to participate in any other way then that would be one way to
> reduce membership (by allowing them to vote without being IPMC members)
> Maybe you can rephrase your comment for me? I may misunderstand.

The legal structure of the Foundation is built upon oversight from the
Board, to the PMCs, to the communities. The individuals who reside within
the IPMC are ... individuals.

If Members happen to be individuals that are participating within the IPMC,
that is wholly orthogonal to everything constructed. Yes, the IPMC gives
them preferential treatment to *join* the IPMC, but they are peers, just
like every other person in the community.

The legal structure is built upon a PMC providing (3) +1 votes on a
release. To be clear: PMC Members. Those with responsibility around the
community producing the release.

Foundation Members have zero say in any of the technical communities. None.
They must earn their merit, and join a PMC to get a binding vote. Their
Membership in the Foundation does not give them any privilege. So, no... a
Foundation Member should not get a privileged vote within the Incubator PMC.

Expand it more broadly: the Board is the representative group of the
Members. They completely and actively shun any attempt to direct/vote in
the technical communities. There are two very distinct groups: those in the
technical communities, and those assisting with the Foundation's
administrative side. Members are in the latter, and they should not get a
vote in Incubator/podling releases. They must *join* the technical
community, via merit, to be afforded that right.


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