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From Roman Shaposhnik <>
Subject Re: Incubator Governance Change
Date Wed, 26 Apr 2017 04:13:28 GMT
On Tue, Apr 25, 2017 at 8:47 PM, P. Taylor Goetz <> wrote:
>> On Apr 25, 2017, at 9:06 PM, Roman Shaposhnik <> wrote:
>> I honestly think its time for us to consider being more board like
>> around here at
>> IPMC. May be not exactly as strict as the board, but moving in that direction.
>> After all, being a podling means being TLP-on-training-wheels. That's the whole
>> idea. If your PMC shrinks -- you have to know what it means. Same here. If your
>> mentors are not active -- you've got to raise hell around here on general@
>> before its too late.
> I mostly agree, but would hesitate with the idea that a podling be responsible for
> raising a red flag when mentors are inactive. If the IPMC isn’t doing it’s job,
> that’s on us, not the projects we incubate.

I am not saying IPMC is off the hook here, but rather I'm trying to instill
a sense of self-reliance in a future TLP.

While PPMC is mostly an artificial construct from the ASF's point of view,
the idea there is to teach podling how the TLP PMC should behave. One
of the traits of this behaviour is to recognize problems within the community
and try to resolve them instead of semi-passively waiting for either board
or IPMC to intervene.

Again, I'm not advocating for shifting the responsibility as much as
I'm advocating
for shift in perspective. I would still expect the IPMC members to be watchful,
but I would also expect them to use every opportunity like that as a teaching
moment. E.g. "oh, so we've noticed you're struggling with mentors being MIA,
we're sorry about that, but have you considered escalating to IPMC and perhaps
soliciting additional mentors?" instead of "oh, so we've noticed
you're struggling
with mentors being MIA, let us fix this for you" (I'm obviously
exaggerating, but you
catch my drift).


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