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From Leo Neumeyer <>
Subject Re: [PROPOSAL] S4 for the Apache Incubator
Date Fri, 16 Sep 2011 01:15:43 GMT
Phil and all,

Great discussion and so happy you want to join the team. No need to apologize !!

My feeling is that if someone wants to join the project as a contributor and has technical
merit he or she will become a committer pretty quickly. I think that having a minimal protocol
is useful to make sure people get to know each other and the project. In fact, the current
policy seems good to me: I love the
DO-ocracy concept and seems to be the best way to become a committer.

So I propose that those who are interested and can volunteer some time, start thinking on
how to contribute. If the project is accepted we will discuss the details in the mailing list.

Thanks again!

On Sep 15, 2011, at 5:54 PM, Phillip Rhodes wrote:

> On Thu, Sep 15, 2011 at 5:34 PM, Flavio Junqueira <> wrote:
>> I have read the guide to participation:
>> and I understand from there that people shouldn't simply jump in as an
>> initial committer without a short introduction and without acknowledgment
>> from the proposer.
> Since I was one of those people, let me issue a "mea culpa" here.  Despite
> having read the participation guidelines (more than once even) I apparently
> slipped into a bit of a conditioned response, from observed behavior.  For
> better or worse, it has become not uncommon (in my experience) to see
> people simply "jump in" and add themselves.  In retrospect, yes, it probably
> is a bit rude, and I apologize for my part in this.
> I suppose t's just what Roy said in 2006: everybody
> saw a certain process appearing to happen, assumed it was policy and
> didn't give it any further thought.  Guess I'm guilty of that.
>> Our expectation when we submitted the proposal was that the initial set of
>> committers would comprise the people who have initially contributed to get
>> the current code to this stage, and we were not expecting arbitrary requests
>> to join the initial list of committers.
> While "jumping in" is - as we've already established - in bad taste, I
> *think* that
> (most|any|some) projects entering incubation should expect such requests.
> Part of the focus of the incubator, as I've understood it, is to
> promote sufficient
> diversity in the community and the team, that no one "block" of people can kill
> the project by dropping out or whatever.  Having new initial
> committers that have
> no outstanding connection to the project is one way to achieve that.
> In this regard, the
> incubation period is radically different from other times in the
> project lifecycle.
> Or, again, that has been my understanding.
> Then again, maybe it only appears that way because some projects make
> it a point to
> appeal to people *to* join in as initial committers.
>> Of course, as a potential Apache
>> project (now potentially incubator, but looking forward to being TLP in the
>> future), we are ready to work towards building a community, which includes
>> granting the status of committer to contributors. However, we'd like new
>> committers to earn their status by showing commitment to the community and
>> demonstrating technical merit.
> Absolutely, and entering the incubator is the only time - AFAIK - that projects
> here tend to take a slightly different stance.  It's all about seeding
> the initial pool
> before the project gets underway.   That said, I'm not sure projects
> are required
> to accept an additional initial committers beyond what the proposer suggests.
> For my own part, I'll just say that I'm excited about S4, very happy
> to volunteer to help, and
> if you guys want me, I'm in.  If not, take me off the list and it'll
> all be cool.  FSM knows, I have
> plenty of stuff to keep me occupied already.  ;-)
> As far as introduction goes...  Well, I founded Fogbeam Labs, started
> the ScrewPile project to
> develop an OSS suite of Enterprise Knowledge Management software.
> I've been a professional
> software engineer for the past 12-13 years, working mostly in Java,
> but some C, C++, Python
> and Groovy as well.  If anyone wants to know more about me, just ask,
> or see:
> Cheers,
> Phil
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