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From "Mattmann, Chris A (388J)" <>
Subject Re: Basing Apache releases on releases from incubating projects
Date Wed, 01 Dec 2010 17:08:23 GMT
Hi Thilo,

>> I hear ya, and I believe you have way more experience in this particular area than
I do. I'm just saying that it would be nice if we could eat our own dog food in this particular
accord, otherwise, what's the Incubator other than an Apache-branded area of code that's subject
to *even stricter* guises. If you what you say is true, then it would seem to me that projects
would benefit then from going to Google Code first, saying they are ASLv2 over there, and
then being included over here in Apache projects (in source or binary form) -- they wouldn't
be subject to the same scrutiny that our Incubator podlings are.
> Oh but they are.  I'm a committer on the new OpenNLP incubator
> project that's just starting up.  It's Apache licensed, but that
> saves us nothing.  

I wouldn't agree with that, actually. It saves you a ton. Postulated scenario:

You guys publish SNAPSHOT (unreleased JAR of OpenNLP) based on current source code available
as downstream dependency at some Maven consumable site.
I'm over here in Apache project X. 
I update my Apache project X to consume your SNAPSHOT OpenNLP jar from Google Code.

That's just an example of where it might save you (and me from Apache project X that wants
to depend on your ASLv2 licensed, unreleased Google Code whiz bang feature Y).

> We're doing a code grant, ICLAs from all current
> and previous contributors, etc etc, the whole nine yards.  The
> fact that the code is already under the Apache license makes hardly
> any difference.

Yep I've had to do this myself on several podlings. That's an IP issue more than anything
else and just cleaner all around since you guys are doing a code drop over here at Apache,

That said, IP is a little bit of a different beast (as are SGA or ICLA) than what I'm getting
at. Basically what I'm saying is that if we've got "ASF Incubator Podlings", that is, Apache
branded code that isn't fully endorsed yet here at Apache yes, but that is *here at Apache*,
then there should be some easier mechanism than "making a release" to include that good work
going on in the ASF Incubator. Releases do not occur often enough in my experience to make
it the gate to include an Incubator podling's code that is itself ASLv2 licensed. There should
be an easier way (read: reward) for projects coming over here and being willing to do it our
way, from the start.


Chris Mattmann, Ph.D.
Senior Computer Scientist
NASA Jet Propulsion Laboratory Pasadena, CA 91109 USA
Office: 171-266B, Mailstop: 171-246
Adjunct Assistant Professor, Computer Science Department
University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA 90089 USA

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