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From Sam Ruby <>
Subject Re: Checkpoint on Harmony (Re: [discussion] Harmony podling to ask for vote for graduation)
Date Thu, 19 Oct 2006 19:05:53 GMT
William A. Rowe, Jr. wrote:
> IMHO - the only reason to have a project (TLP or subproject, no matter) is
> to release code.  Anything prior to a release might be a sandbox, it might
> be a podling, it might be a lose alliance of the willing.  Whatever...
> That said ... I don't believe anyone is saying Harmony must release it's
> entire codebase to graduate.  Any working and usable component or part of
> the harness could be released as 0.1 alpha version, the processes followed,
> the issues raised and resolved.  With a codebase as large as Harmony, I sure
> don't expect the whole ball of wax to be ready, or at the same level of
> stability, all at once.

Be aware that in the context of J2SE, a "release" must fulfill some 
compatibility requirements.  Included in this is a requirement not to 

Of course, one could simply manufacture a synthetic release for the 
purposes of satisfying a perceived incubation requirement, but honestly, 
that seems more like one of the "ticky-marks driven processes" I tend to 
see within my day job than anything I would expect to see at the ASF.

> So as much as I admire the enthusiasm of the entire community and know that
> the vote will disappoint some folks, I'll repeat my root question; how does
> incubation status interfere with progress of the Harmony project prior to
> its first release?

If you forgive me, let me propose a thought experiment.  Why don't we 
simply dissolve the board, and throw everything back into incubation? 
What would it hurt?  Projects obviously have been holding releases 
during incubation, many have had multiple releases.

No, that's not a serious proposal.  What I am growing increasingly 
concerned with is that we (collectively) have started to lose sight on 
what the mission of the incubator is.  Yes, not having a release is an 
indicator, but there certainly are other indicators.  No, I'm not 
advocating that we "rush" projects out of the incubator.

What I am looking for is a happy medium.  In particular, I would like to 
see is for the rate of disposition (either in a positive or negative 
manner) of projects in the incubator approximate the rate of creation.

More succinctly: I want to see projects that are ready to graduate start 
graduating, not because it benefits them, but because befits the incubator.

Returning the subject back to Harmony, with regard to a release, what 
matters more to me is whether or not those who are directly involved 
with Harmony (which most decidedly does *not* include me) are interested 
in producing a release at this time.  If not, and if their reasons make 
sense, then I would be inclined to respect their wishes.

- Sam Ruby

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