incubator-general mailing list archives

Site index · List index
Message view « Date » · « Thread »
Top « Date » · « Thread »
From Dan Diephouse <>
Subject Re: PPMCs [was Re: what are required for contributing to release management]
Date Sun, 01 Oct 2006 15:36:07 GMT
Hi Jim,

Jim Jagielski wrote:

> On Sep 30, 2006, at 11:51 AM, Jason van Zyl wrote:
>> On 28 Sep 06, at 12:59 PM 28 Sep 06, Garrett Rooney wrote:
>>> Well, PMCs are formed by the board when a project moves to top level
>>> status.  PPMCs are formed for an incubating project, and exactly how
>>> that works tends to differ a bit between projects.  Some mentors  start
>>> off with just the mentors on the PPMC, and then invite project  members
>>> as time goes on (or that's the impression I've gotten).  Others just
>>> start with the whole group of committers plus the mentors on the PPMC
>>> (that's what we did with Abdera).
>> I think starting with the mentors is the wisest choice as at that  
>> point any committers can be brought aboard if deemed fit. So that  
>> can support both models as all committers can be brought aboard if  
>> it fits, or over time if more suitable. I was also confused about  
>> this as I heard one thing from Noel and one thing from Jim, but the  
>> mentors deciding seems sensible as projects can be dealt with on a  
>> case by case basis. I don't believe committers should automatically  
>> be made (P)PMC members as to me it's a different level of  
>> understanding and commitment.

I assume you're referring to this sentence:

"Initially, it is composed of the Podling's mentors and initial committers."

I have also found some threads which indicate that all committers should 
be added [1][2]. I want to know here - who is wrong? The documentation? 
Or the previous incubated projects who didn't add all the initial 
committers? There is also the following sentence which adds some doubt 
that the above is the official policy:

"The PPMC is directly responsible for the oversight of the podling and 
it also decides who to add as a PPMC member."

While this could be referrering to post PPMC formation, it isn't clear.  
I will happily make a patch for the documentation to make things more 
clear if there is consensus.

I am pretty philosophically against making every committer PPMC members. 
Apache is meritocracy based and IMO it makes much more sense to start 
with the mentors on the PPMC and have committers voted on based on their 
leadership. There may be many people on the incubation proposal or who 
have committed code to a project in the past, but an additional level of 
leadership is needed [3]. Not everyone may have the necessary leadership 
skills, and to presuppose they do because they have contributed good 
code, is IMO, a mistake.

- Dan

3. See Project Management Committee section here

Dan Diephouse
(616) 971-2053
Envoi Solutions LLC

To unsubscribe, e-mail:
For additional commands, e-mail:

View raw message