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From Davanum Srinivas <>
Subject Re: Incubating java projects
Date Wed, 21 Dec 2005 14:42:39 GMT

Incubation process is not set in stone. Just last week, we voted on
standardizing the mailing list names. So it is a mix of good
judgement, experience, consensus and rules. If you insist we can put
start a VOTE on pmc@incubator. I think you are part of that as well.

I did bring up issues on the pmc@geronimo mailing lists and we
resolved it. As to "related-ness". I'd even be ok with ActiveMQ as a
TLP or ServiceMix as a TLP. But it does not seem right to be part of
Geronimo as a sub project. I'd prefer ServiceMix folks to work more
closely with WS folks or even move to WS-land. But that's another
story. FYI, am and Guillaume Nodet did work during the hackathon on
some stuff. But i'd like to see more closer cooperation. Especially
for items that you need and those that affect Geronimo like JAX-WS
2.0/JAXB. It's not like we want all ws stuff to be in ws pmc. JSR 181
in Beehive and WSRP4J in portals are good examples of sister projects
that still work closely with Axis dev folks.

Also, what does "community" means? does it mean existing folks who are
working on the projects already at codehaus? Especially when Syanpse
and Axis are mentioned in the proposal and we don't see anyone show up
on the dev mailing lists, it's just fishy to say the least. FYI, this
is not the first time i had to do this. I did this with beehive too.
See my post in Oct 2004 articulating the same concerns with beehive.

thanks for listening,

On 12/21/05, James Strachan <> wrote:
> On 21 Dec 2005, at 13:02, Davanum Srinivas wrote:
> > James,
> >
> > To be blunt, what is being done here? here's what i see as a casual
> > observer to the infra list.
> >
> > - A bunch of projects are getting into Apache controlled by the same
> > set of people (ServiceMix/ActiveMQ/XBean/WADI)
> Not really; see the committer lists, they are all quite different.
> But sure there's a bunch of existing apache developers who work on
> some of those projects along with other Apache projects too.
> > - Folks are getting completely unrelated projects into an umbrella
> > project "Geronimo"
> If anything is this an issue for Geronimo PMC not the incubator. Why
> have you not brought this up there as you are a member of the PMC?
> > - Folks involved want everything under the sun to be supported by
> > infra folks
> Huh? So far the ServiceMix & ActiveMQ teams have only asked for
> subversion & mail :)
> > - Folks dont want to use as the mailing list
> > domain
> See the other thread for that - the arguments for and against have
> been fairly well articulated.
> > - Folks dont want to even change their package name
> I'm just asking an honest question here - I've already said, if there
> really is a rule we'll follow it. I just want to know is there a rule
> and if there is why does it exist.
> > - Folks just want to do what they want to do regardless of precedent
> Hardly - this is why we're asking for guidance on the incubator list
> to see what we should do.
> James
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