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From Cliff Schmidt <>
Subject Re: Proposal for STDCXX
Date Sat, 14 May 2005 00:02:07 GMT

This looks great.  A few notes/questions inline below.


On 5/13/05, Heidi Buelow <> wrote:
> Proposal for an Apache-run version of the C++ Standard Library


> Rogue Wave Software will jump start this project by contributing the
> commercial C++ Standard Library it has been shipping for over a decade. This
> is a new, enhanced version of the OEM library provided by many vendors,
> including ARM, Sun Microsystems, HP and others. 

I saw the HP licensing note below, which seems fine; but, if the
library was provided by other vendors, can you clarify the state of
any other IP claims on the initial contribution?

> As a side note, Rogue Wave Software intends to continue distributing the
> library as part of its SourcePro/C++ product well into the future. This
> means that significant effort will continue, especially in porting, and that
> effort will directly benefit the open source community since even code
> developed to meet commercial requirements will be contributed back into the
> community.

When you say "the code will be contributed back into the community",
do you mean that Rogue Wave will work on in-house ports and
occasionally drop new versions over the top of what happens to be in
Apache at the time, or that Rogue Wave will be iteratively improving
the code base/ports in collaboration with other committers on the
project?  Of course, I'm hoping you mean the latter; but, please
clarify.  There's nothing wrong with additional future contributions
(in fact, that's goodness); but periodic replacements of a bunch of
existing code would obviously be disruptive to the other committers.

> Initial Reliance on Salaried Workers: At the time of the initial proposal,
> only one external developer has agreed to volunteer as a top-level
> contributor. However, in discussions with members of the Apache community,
> as well as partners and customers, it is clear that there is already
> significant interest. Members of other Apache projects have indicated a
> desire to participate and there is optimism that by the time the project is
> set to begin more contributors from within Apache and the user community
> will be enrolled.

Hopefully, you'll find some more interest from other folks reading
this thread.

> The license grant given by HP should
> conform to the rules of the ASF license, and is included below:
> Copyright (c) 1994 Hewlett-Packard Company
> Permission to use, copy, modify, distribute and sell this software and its
> documentation for any purpose is hereby granted without fee, provided that
> the above copyright notice appear in all copies and that both that copyright
> notice and this permission notice appear in supporting documentation.
> Hewlett-Packard Company makes no representations about the suitability of
> this software for any purpose. It is provided "as is" without express or
> implied warranty.

This should be fine, as long as this notice can be placed in the
NOTICE and/or LICENSE file of any distribution, and not required to be
at the top of every source file.

> The initial tarball made available on the web site will not be immediately
> ready to include in a public CVS/SVN repository. The file set is quite
> large, and has significant complexity, especially to support dozens of
> platforms out of a single code base. The code and directory structure will
> therefore need a thorough review to be sure they are efficiently packaged
> for public, group development. We don't expect this to take long, but wanted
> to set proper expectations.

I certainly understand that it takes time once a project is accepted
to align your company's logistics with the Apache infrastructure, but
can you give us an idea of a) roughly how long are you expecting, and
b) will the eventual contribution be significantly different than what
you have posted now?

> (3.3) Bugzilla

Sure you don't want to use Jira?

> (5) identify apache sponsoring individual
> Justin Erenkrantz (justin @ erenkrantz dot-com)

That says a lot!  (in a good way ;-)

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