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From Nicola Ken Barozzi <>
Subject Re: Some sparse nots about changes to the incubation process
Date Thu, 10 Jul 2003 07:46:39 GMT

Steven Noels wrote, On 10/07/2003 9.23:
> On 10/07/2003 8:59 Paul Hammant wrote:
>> Nicola,
>>> Nope.
>>> @see
>>> No Incubator logo, no mailing lists, no 
>>> reference to the incubation status.
>> I stand corrected.
> Isn't <cite href="">Apache Lenya is a 
> Cocoon subproject under incubation.</cite> a fair enough reference? 

IMHO no.

> I 
> don't get the core of the problem anymore. While I agree upon the 
> concept of an Incubator, if its main functions are actually carried out 
> by the receiving PMC, I wonder what all the fuzz of mentioning the 
> Incubator is about.

AFAIK the project is under the Incubator PMC, and we are responsible for it.

> I think the value proposition of the Incubator should be more directed 
> at the receiving PMC and the Foundation, and less at the incubating 
> project. The incubating project primarily interacts with the receiving 
> PMC, which can call upon help to the Incubator. This is about the same 
> way new folks and projects interact with Infrastructure, which requires 
> the PMC to be informed of infrastructure requests. The PMC is the 
> facilitator, and checks whether people actually get an answer. Or that 
> should be the theory, IMHO.

Hmmm, I get your point. My concerns are about *clear* and *traceable* 
responsibility. It seems easier for me: we are responsible for it, we 
keep it, we shove it on the next PMC when ready. Clear-cut lines are 
easier to manage.

When two are responsible for a thing, nobody is. ;-)

I'm not *that* sure about going this way, but given the issue (albeit 
minor given the management done on PMC lists) that has come out with 
Lenya, this is IMHO our best bet in not making it happen again.

Paul seems in favor of this too AFAI see, so much in fact that he 
thought it was our standard :-)

WRT Incubator VS Recieving PMC

- Before we said: we are the incubator, we incubate
- Then we have said: you are the project recieving, you incubate
- Now I'd rather see: we have this project you want, incubate it, we 
will give a hand, and it will become part of your projects

>>> > No need for vote?
>>> These are sparse notes, not a VOTE, man. ;-)
>> Other before me voted :-)
> That wasn't a vote, but fractional enthusiasm. :-)

Yeah, that was fun :-)

Nicola Ken Barozzi         
             - verba volant, scripta manent -
    (discussions get forgotten, just code remains)

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