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From Lars Francke <>
Subject Re: overzealous bureaucracy (was: [VOTE] Zipkin leave incubator, return back to OpenZipkin)
Date Thu, 20 Jun 2019 07:37:29 GMT
This was also discussed on the ASF slack during which I suggested (this is
not fully thought through) to change the Incubator model to focus on its
core tenets of providing services to projects wanting to join the ASF.
For this cause, the projects itself don't need to be ASF projects (not even
Apache Foo but just Foo). They don't have to use the ASF infrastructure but
they can if they want but probably under a different domain/name.

This is like Github++, you can still use everything there (or Gitlab or
whatever) but you also get the community, people to help you out, mailing
lists, etc.
But you wouldn't need to do any voting on releases, no reports for the
board, no NOTICE or DISCLAIMER files etc.

Projects wishing to join the ASF as a TLP would then at some point need to
abide by the rules (some of which probably also don't make sense but that's
a different discussion) but until then Mentors could just provide hints
instead of -1 or strongly worded mails. "Hey, I see you're doing releases
like this, if you'd like to join as a TLP you need a vote on releases and
it works like this, wanna try next time?"

This is very much not thought through to the end. One question raised for
example is whether projects would even want to become a TLP.
The mission states: "We do this by providing services and support for many
like-minded software project communities consisting of individuals who
choose to participate in ASF activities."
I don't see anything in there requiring anyone to "join" (I remember the
recent discussions about that). If you sign up to Github you're not all of
a sudden a "Github project" but still benefit from its services.

We could do something similar.

On Thu, Jun 20, 2019 at 3:48 AM Olivier Lamy <> wrote:

> Good effort Bertrand that's definitely some discussions we should have and
> ease incubation!
> To be honest I'm mentoring some projects but sometimes I'm out of
> motivation due to the huge number of nitpicking tasks/requests.
> I perfectly understand people reactions when they try to go trough the
> incubation process.. (disclaimer it's an email from the peanut gallery....)
> So yes let's make Apache incubation great again..
> On Thu, 20 Jun 2019 at 03:28, Bertrand Delacretaz <
>> wrote:
> > On Wed, Jun 19, 2019 at 7:14 PM Ted Dunning <>
> wrote:
> > > ...This vote is *confirming* that
> > > nobody has objections (of any form) to Zipkin leaving and control of
> the
> > > git repos being transferred...
> >
> > I agree and this means that in this case a [LAZY] vote would have been
> > sufficient.
> >
> > -Bertrand
> >
> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
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> >
> >
> --
> Olivier Lamy
> |

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