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From Julian Hyde <jh...@apache.org>
Subject Re: [DISCUSS] Absent mentors
Date Sun, 02 Sep 2018 01:26:12 GMT
I hear what you’re saying. As a metric it’s better than nothing, but let’s not assume
it is telling us everything.

I believe that asking all mentors to sign off is a change in policy or at least in practice.
(Neither the “Mentors’ guide”[1] nor the “Guide to being a mentor”[2] talks about
signing off.) This could be a useful opportunity to remind mentors of what is expected of
them.

One gray area has always bugged me. How hard should mentors push a podling to submit a report?
If the podling fails to submit a report, or submits it late, it is impossible for mentors
to sign off, and therefore counts as a black mark against the mentors. I believe that mentors
should facilitate and guide, but pushing and nagging is counterproductive.

Julian

[1] https://incubator.apache.org/guides/mentor.html <https://incubator.apache.org/guides/mentor.html>

[2] https://community.apache.org/guide-to-being-a-mentor.html <https://community.apache.org/guide-to-being-a-mentor.html>


> On Sep 1, 2018, at 5:14 PM, Justin Mclean <justin@classsoftware.com> wrote:
> 
> Hi,
> 
>> There is a strong presumption here that a mentor is fulfilling their duty if and
only if they sign the reports.
> 
> It’s an imperfect metric but one we have easy access to. If we send out an email asking
for if you’re AWOL and a mentor responds that they are active then all is good. Of course
it’s not going to catch mentors who sign reports and do nothing else but I hope there’s
only a few incidences of that.
> 
>> I’m skeptical. I can think of cases where an engaged mentor does not sign reports
(because someone else has done it), and vice versa where a disengaged mentor shows up once
a quarter to sign the report.
> 
> IMO The reports should be signed off by all mentors where possible not just one or two,
that way the mentor only signing reports (and doing nothing else) is less of an issue.
> 
>> It may be a bit more difficult to measure, but I think a better indicator would be
the number of messages sent by the mentor to dev and private lists. It indicates both time
spent writing the message and also time spent keeping up with the email traffic to know when
the podling needs help. 
> 
> Given we have 100+ people to check and some of them are involved in multiple projects,
that’s a lot of lists to check but it would be possible. I could put it up in a shared doc
and if other people help out then it wouldn’t be too much effort.
> 
> Alternately I could take 10 mentors at random if any of them are active on their mailing
lists, I’m guessing there a strong correlation between not signing off reports and absent
mentors.
> 
> Thanks,
> Justin
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