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From Dave Fisher <dave2w...@comcast.net>
Subject Re: Graduation Resolutions Should Not Include Project Bylaws Clause
Date Mon, 03 Sep 2018 01:08:27 GMT
Hi -

Sent from my iPhone

> On Sep 2, 2018, at 3:29 PM, P. Taylor Goetz <ptgoetz@gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> Aren’t the foundation-level bylaws about how the ASF operates as a non-profit business?
> 
> I may be missing something, but ASF bylaws don’t address project management, ASF policy
does.

The trouble is that projects are copying bylaws from each other which do not conform to ASF
policy.

In particular they are copying the project “killing” 6 month inactivity means automatic
PMC emeritus measure when there is no such thing at the foundation level.

From the IPMC and board side we expect that new projects have learned the Apache Way before
they graduate and then we task them
With making it up after the fact.

I agree with Greg that the Board should make the call, but I do think the IPMC should make
a recommendation. I do not think that projects should have to opt out of making bylaws. I
think that they should make policies including voting policies that fit the “minimal”
Apache policies.

Regards,
Dave

> 
> -Taylor
> 
>> On Sep 2, 2018, at 5:25 PM, John D. Ament <johndament@apache.org> wrote:
>> 
>> -private list for now.
>> 
>> 
>> I disagree with removing the bylaws clause.  It's assumed your going to use
>> the ASF level bylaws if you don't have another one.
>> 
>>> On Sun, Sep 2, 2018, 14:29 Dave Fisher <dave2wave@comcast.net> wrote:
>>> 
>>> Note the cross-posting between public and private mailing lists.
>>> 
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>> 
>>>> On Sep 2, 2018, at 11:22 AM, Kevin A. McGrail <kmcgrail@apache.org>
>>> wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> Good point, Dave.  +board as this was an issue with emeritus pmc and
>>>> project bylaws
>>>> 
>>>>> On Sun, Sep 2, 2018, 12:37 Dave Fisher <dave2wave@comcast.net>
wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>> Hi -
>>>>> 
>>>>> Pulsar is currently discussing a graduation proposal and Taylor noticed
>>>>> the following that came out of the whimsy boilerplate.
>>>>> 
>>>>> Quick question:
>>>>> 
>>>>> RESOLVED, that the initial Apache Pulsar PMC be and hereby is tasked
>>>>> with the creation of a set of bylaws intended to encourage open
>>>>> development and increased participation in the Apache Pulsar Project;
>>>>> and be it further
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> Does the Pulsar PPMC feel the need to adopt bylaws (it’s not required),
>>> or
>>>>> are the Apache defaults acceptable?
>>>>> 
>>>>> One option is to simply not have bylaws, which means you would simply
>>>>> adhere to [1] and [2], and put any clarifications in a contributors’
>>> guide
>>>>> (which you’ve done).
>>>>> 
>>>>> -Taylor
>>>>> 
>>>>> [1] http://www.apache.org/foundation/voting.html
>>>>> [2] http://www.apache.org/dev/pmc.html
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> I think that this clause needs to be removed from the template.
>>>>> 
>>>>> Regards,
>>>>> Dave
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
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