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From Geertjan Wielenga <geertjan.wiele...@googlemail.com>
Subject Re: Preliminary NetBeans cost findings (was: [DISCUSS] Apache NetBeans Incubator Proposal)
Date Sun, 25 Sep 2016 16:50:27 GMT
On Sun, Sep 25, 2016 at 5:45 PM, Ross Gardler wrote:


> What I'm saying is that to make a case for extra budget there needs to be
> solid justification that  a move to ASF will help the community grow.


This is the first I've heard of this.

My one data point is http://pages.zeroturnaround.com/RebelLabs-Developer-
> Productivity-Report-2016.html?utm_source=rebellabs_allreports&utm_medium=
> rebellabs&utm_campaign=rebellabs (requires sign in). That reports shows a
> decline from 14% in 2012 to 10% today. To be fair that has been steady
> since 2014.


Here's my thoughts on that survey:
https://blogs.oracle.com/geertjan/entry/adding_some_color_to_the

 If my data (limited to the above single data point) is
> inaccurate/invalid/not representative then you should have no problem
> providing evidence to the contrary when you ask for this budget.


In all fairness, it's simply impossible to prove the comparative usage of
one development tool over another.

I'm also concerned that this is a discussion point at all in this context.

Thanks,

Geertjan





On Sun, Sep 25, 2016 at 6:22 PM, Bertrand Delacretaz <bdelacretaz@apache.org
> wrote:

> Hi Daniel,
>
> On Sat, Sep 24, 2016 at 12:17 PM, Daniel Gruno <humbedooh@apache.org>
> wrote:
> > ...ballpark costs, bandwidth, machines needed and so forth, and the cliff
> > notes are as follows...
>
> Thanks very much for this - it is useful and I think we should do that
> for any "big" podling that comes in, from now on.
>
> > ...Thus, I would submit to the IPMC that they consider asking the board
> for
> > a budget of roughly $10k per year for the NetBeans project, as well as
> > the additional time required of Infrastructure to implement this into
> > the existing ASF infra....
>
> I don't think asking for budget is a task of the Incubator PMC, I would
> suggest
>
> 1. Incubator PMC/infra estimates the cost of new podlings as you did
> 2. Incubator PMC reports those numbers to ASF infra at regular
> intervals, maybe just include them in their monthly reports
> 3. Infra adds the numbers up and if needed asks for more budget based
> on these podlings
>
> For now, considering that the numbers you indicate won't make a big
> dent in the current infra budget [1] and considering that it's the
> first time we do such an analysis I suggest for the infra team to
> accept decoupling the NetBeans acceptance vote from the details of
> these numbers, and we'll sort out the corresponding budget later at
> the board / infra level.
>
> -Bertrand
>
> [1] https://www.apache.org/foundation/records/minutes/
> 2015/board_minutes_2015_04_22.txt
> for example
>
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