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From Daniel Gruno <>
Subject Re: Reform of Incubator {was; [DISCUSSION] Graduate Ignite from the Apache Incubator)
Date Mon, 03 Aug 2015 20:01:58 GMT

On 2015-08-03 21:13, Roman Shaposhnik wrote:
> Yup. I believe this to be an unfortunate (at least from my standpoint)
> but and extremely fair observation.
> As far as I'm concerned the issue of R&Rs of IPMC is in a state of a
> stalemate right now. We clearly have a "everything's fine lets just
> add more policy" constituency vs. "IPMC should be small and more
> board like" crowd.

I don't think anyone is suggesting we add more policy - at least, I 
haven't heard anyone say that. I'd rather say we're caught between "the 
policy is fine, but we may need to streamline the process" and "the 
policy is hindering development and needs to be trimmed".

I count myself among the 'followers' of the first statement. I think the 
policy itself is sound, but the process of incubation leaves something 
to be desired. In my view, if a release, graduation, vote etc is being 
held up by the IPMC, that is not the fault of the policy, it is the 
fault of tacit knowledge not being shared and used among mentors and 
podlings in an efficient manner. If a release is being held up due to 
missing/incorrect licenses or notices, that is an issue we should solve 
through better education and tooling in the Incubator. If a podling 
wants to graduate, but legitimate concerns (however true or unfounded 
they may be) are raised, that is an issue we should solve - or at least 
make speedier - through better education and tooling/processes.

I see a lot of places where we can definitely improve on processes, make 
them faster and easier, but what I do not see is how the policies are to 
blame. The very fact that these policies cause discussions and delays 
are, in my view, not a nuisance that needs to be abolished, but proof 
that we have procedural and educational flaws. Again, I would be very 
interested in working with people on improving these processes and tools.

I would also ask the people who think we need to trim down our policies 
to be more specific about which policies need to be removed or changed, 
and how it would help the Incubator while still retaining the core 
mission of it; To educate and grow communities wishing to follow the 
Apache Way.

With regards,

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