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From "P. Taylor Goetz" <ptgo...@gmail.com>
Subject Re: [DISCUSSION] Graduate Ignite from the Apache Incubator
Date Tue, 21 Jul 2015 21:13:49 GMT
It seems to me the spirit of the diversity statement is about project survival:

>   A healthy project should survive the departure of any single contributor
>   or employer of contributors.

So I would think satisfying that requirement wouldn’t necessarily involve a percentage,
but rather a simple number: At least 3 PMC members who are not affiliated with the employer
of the majority.

That way if the employer of the majority departed, there would be enough remaining members
for form consensus.

-Taylor


> On Jul 21, 2015, at 4:55 PM, jan i <jani@apache.org> wrote:
> 
> On 21 July 2015 at 22:48, Daniel Gruno <humbedooh@apache.org> wrote:
> 
>> 
>> On 07/21/2015 10:39 PM, Ted Dunning wrote:
>>> Present time diversity or lack of same is not a bar to graduation.
>> 
>> So we should just scrap the bit in the Incubator policy that says "A
>> major criterion for graduation is to have developed an open and diverse
>> meritocratic community."?
>> 
>> I think not.
>> 
> 
> If diversity does not matter, then please explain these references:
> http://www.apache.org/foundation/how-it-works.html
> 
> Diversity of committership is important for two main reasons:
> 
>   -
> 
>   it gives long term stability to the project development: in fact, with
>   all the developers affiliated to the same entity, the chance of seeing all
>   of them moving away from the project at the same time is much greater than
>   with a community of individuals affiliated to unrelated entities.
>   -
> 
>   it gives a greater variety of technical visions: something that
>   guarantees a better adherence to environment and user's needs, thus a
>   higher change of finding real-life use of the software.
> 
> http://www.apache.org/foundation/board/reporting
> 
>   -
> 
>   PMC and committer diversity
> 
>   A healthy project should survive the departure of any single contributor
>   or employer of contributors. Healthy projects also serve needs of many
>   parties. Thus the ASF prefers that projects have diverse PMCs and
>   committerships. *IF* the PMC has any concerns or perceives a problem
>   with the diversity, then the report should include information on the
>   number of unique organizations currently represented in its PMC and
>   committership.
> 
> If diversity did not matter for TLPs, the above explanation and guidelines
> are false
> 
> 
> I think not.
> 
> 
> rgds
> 
> jan I.
> 
> 
>> 
>> 
>>> 
>>> What is important is that the committers and PMC of the new project
>>> understand how to make releases and are building community.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> On Tue, Jul 21, 2015 at 1:30 PM, Pierre Smits <pierre.smits@gmail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>> 
>>>> Thanks, Konstantin, for the enlighting quote. And the link leading to
>>>> nowhere.
>>>> 
>>>> If we take away the names of the mentors from the list (Branko, Roman
>> and
>>>> yours) as well as those in other projects (Evans) from the list of
>> intended
>>>> project members, the situation even grows worse. Then the number grows
>> to
>>>> 77%. That doesn't look promising regarding independence, and neither
>>>> regarding healthiness.
>>>> 
>>>> Best regards,
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> Pierre Smits
>>>> 
>>>> *ORRTIZ.COM <http://www.orrtiz.com>*
>>>> Services & Solutions for Cloud-
>>>> Based Manufacturing, Professional
>>>> Services and Retail & Trade
>>>> http://www.orrtiz.com
>>>> 
>>>> On Tue, Jul 21, 2015 at 8:53 PM, Konstantin Boudnik <cos@apache.org>
>>>> wrote:
>>>> 
>>>>> The so-called diversity requirement has been discussed on this list
>> for a
>>>>> number of times. Most recent is the graduation of Flume project (back
>> in
>>>>> 2012). Here's a quote from that thread (kudos to Roy; for those who
>> want
>>>>> to look it up in the archives MessageId is
>>>>> 73DB2E64-87D5-4DD5-91FB-403464895AC5@gbiv.com):
>>>>> 
>>>>> [quote]
>>>>> There is no diversity requirement at the ASF.  There is a behavior
>>>>> requirement for graduation and a behavior requirement for TLPs.
>>>>> We must not confuse the two. If the Incubator says that there is a
>>>>> diversity requirement for graduation, ignore it (or at least figure
>>>>> out what the docs were supposed to say and then do that).
>>>>> I'd urge folks to fix the docs, but I know where that leads ...
>>>>> and I have no cycles to spare.
>>>>> 
>>>>> A diversity requirement would mean that a person's employment
>>>>> status impacts their ability to participate here.  IOW, it would
>>>>> create a perverse incentive for them not to be employed.
>>>>> [/quote]
>>>>> 
>>>>> Regards,
>>>>>  Cos
>>>>> 
>>>>> On Tue, Jul 21, 2015 at 05:55PM, Pierre Smits wrote:
>>>>>> It seems that 63% of the podling's PMC is affiliated to 1 organisation
>>>>>> (Gridgrain).
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Have sufficient grounds been covered to ensure diversity and
>>>> independece?
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Best regards,
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Pierre Smits
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> On Tue, Jul 21, 2015 at 5:13 PM, Dmitriy Setrakyan <
>>>>> dsetrakyan@apache.org>
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> On Tue, Jul 21, 2015 at 4:08 AM, amareshwarisr . <
>>>>> amareshwari@gmail.com>
>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> Seems the DESCRIPTION_AND_SCOPE of the project is set to
" the
>>>>> automated
>>>>>>>> and managed flow of information between systems."
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> I dont see any such on project website -
>>>>>>>> http://ignite.incubator.apache.org/
>>>>>>>> Looks like a copy from NIFI's graduation discussion -
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>> 
>> http://mail-archives.apache.org/mod_mbox/incubator-general/201506.mbox/%3CCALJK9a4PD%2B3qGGQbbHHyLfY8Ut9BP9VyEDwtnZDSWjpMKiwk9w%40mail.gmail.com%3E
>>>>>>>> .
>>>>>>>> You might want to correct it.
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Yup, copy-n-paste never works :) Corrected below.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> Correct me if description is fine and  I'm wrong in understanding
>>>> the
>>>>>>>> description
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> Thanks
>>>>>>>> Amareshwari
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> On Tue, Jul 21, 2015 at 5:06 AM, Dmitriy Setrakyan <
>>>>>>> dsetrakyan@apache.org>
>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> Hello Apache Incubator,
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> At the suggestion of our mentors the Ignite community
established
>>>>>>>> consensus
>>>>>>>>> and held a successful vote with 14 +1 votes in favor
of proposing
>>>>>>>>> graduation to TLP.
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> Vote thread:
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>> 
>> http://apache-ignite-developers.2346864.n4.nabble.com/VOTE-Graduate-Apache-Ignite-from-Incubation-td1539.html
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> Summary of the vote results:
>>>>>>>>> +1 (non-binding) = 14
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>   1. Yakov Zhdanov (PMC)
>>>>>>>>>   2. Gianfranco Murador (PMC)
>>>>>>>>>   3. Ira Vasilinets (PMC)
>>>>>>>>>   4. Nikolai Tichinov (PMC)
>>>>>>>>>   5. Semyon Boikov (PMC)
>>>>>>>>>   6. Sergi Vladykin (PMC)
>>>>>>>>>   7. Alexey Goncharuk (PMC)
>>>>>>>>>   8. Ognen Duzlevski (PMC)
>>>>>>>>>   9. Valentin Kulichenko (PMC)
>>>>>>>>>   10. Nikita Ivanov (PMC)
>>>>>>>>>   11. Dmitriy Setrakyan (PMC)
>>>>>>>>>   12. Andrey Novikov (Committer)
>>>>>>>>>   13. Alexey Kuznetsov (Committer)
>>>>>>>>>   14. Milap Wadwa
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> We’d like to initiate this discussion/proposal to establish
a
>>>>> consensus
>>>>>>>>> within the incubator and if appropriate will initiate
a vote.
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> Below is our proposed resolution:
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> Thank you
>>>>>>>>> Dmitriy Setrakyan(on behalf of the Apache Ignite PPMC)
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> SUBJECT: Establish the Apache Ignite TLP
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>    WHEREAS, the Board of Directors deems it to be in
the best
>>>>>>>>>    interests of the Foundation and consistent with the
>>>>>>>>>    Foundation's purpose to establish a Project Management
>>>>>>>>>    Committee charged with the creation and maintenance
of
>>>>>>>>>    open-source software, for distribution at no charge
to
>>>>>>>>>    the public, related to the automated and managed flow
of
>>>>>>>>>    information between systems.
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Should be:
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> ---------
>>>>>>> "related to delivering an In-Memory Data Fabric - a high-performance,
>>>>>>> integrated and distributed in-memory platform for computing and
>>>>> transacting
>>>>>>> on large-scale data sets in real-time"
>>>>>>> --------
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>    NOW, THEREFORE, BE IT RESOLVED, that a Project Management
>>>>>>>>>    Committee (PMC), to be known as the "Apache Ignite
Project",
>>>>>>>>>    be and hereby is established pursuant to Bylaws of
the
>>>>>>>>>    Foundation; and be it further
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>    RESOLVED, that the Apache Ignite Project be and hereby
is
>>>>>>>>>    responsible for the creation and maintenance of software
>>>>>>>>>    related to the automated and managed flow of information
>>>>>>>>>    between systems and be it further
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>    RESOLVED, that the office of "Vice President, Apache
Ignite"
>>>> be
>>>>>>>>>    and hereby is created, the person holding such office
to
>>>>>>>>>    serve at the direction of the Board of Directors as
the chair
>>>>>>>>>    of the Apache Ignite Project, and to have primary
>>>>> responsibility
>>>>>>>>>    for management of the projects within the scope of
>>>>>>>>>    responsibility of the Apache Ignite Project; and be
it
>>>> further
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>    RESOLVED, that the persons listed immediately below
be and
>>>>>>>>>    hereby are appointed to serve as the initial members
of the
>>>>>>>>>    Apache Ignite Project:
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>    Semyon Boikov (sboikov@apache.org)
>>>>>>>>>    Konstantin Boudnik (cos@apache.org)
>>>>>>>>>    Branko Čibej (brane@apache.org)
>>>>>>>>>    Ognen Duzlevski (maketo@apache.org)
>>>>>>>>>    Sergey Evdokimov (sevdokimov@apache.org)
>>>>>>>>>    Alexey Goncharuk (agoncharuk@apache.org)
>>>>>>>>>    Nikita Ivanov (nivanov30@apache.org)
>>>>>>>>>    Sergey Khisamov (skh@apache.org)
>>>>>>>>>    Valentin Kulichenko (vkulichenko@apache.org)
>>>>>>>>>    Alexey Kuznetsov (akuznetsov@apache.org)
>>>>>>>>>    Gianfranco Murador (murador@apache.org)
>>>>>>>>>    Andrey Novikov (anovikov@apache.org)
>>>>>>>>>    Vladimir Ozerov (vozerov@apache.org)
>>>>>>>>>    Dmitriy Setrakyan (dsetrakyan@apache.org)
>>>>>>>>>    Roman Shaposhnik (rvs@apache.org)
>>>>>>>>>    Ilya Sterin (isterin@apache.org)
>>>>>>>>>    Nikolai Tikhonov (ntikhonov@apache.org)
>>>>>>>>>    Irina Vasilinets (ivasilinets@apache.org)
>>>>>>>>>    Anton Vinogradov (av@apache.org)
>>>>>>>>>    Sergey Vladykin (svladykin@apache.org)
>>>>>>>>>    Evans Ye (evansye@apache.org)
>>>>>>>>>    Yakov Zhdanov (yzhdanov@apache.org)
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>    NOW, THEREFORE, BE IT FURTHER RESOLVED, that
>>>>>>>>>    Dmitriy Setrakyan be appointed to the office of Vice
>>>> President,
>>>>>>>>>    Apache Ignite, to serve in accordance with and subject
to the
>>>>>>>>>    direction of the Board of Directors and the Bylaws
of the
>>>>>>>>>    Foundation until death, resignation, retirement, removal
or
>>>>>>>>>    disqualification, or until a successor is appointed;
>>>>>>>>>    and be it further
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>    RESOLVED, that the initial Apache Ignite PMC be and
hereby is
>>>>>>>>>    tasked with the creation of a set of bylaws intended
to
>>>>>>>>>    encourage open development and increased participation
in the
>>>>>>>>>    Apache Ignite Project; and be it further
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>    RESOLVED, that the Apache Ignite Project be and hereby
>>>>>>>>>    is tasked with the migration and rationalization of
the
>>>> Apache
>>>>>>>>>    Incubator Ignite podling; and be it further
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>    RESOLVED, that all responsibilities pertaining to
the Apache
>>>>>>>>>    Incubator Ignite podling encumbered upon the Apache
Incubator
>>>>>>>>>    Project are hereafter discharged.
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>> 
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>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>> 
>>> 
>> 
>> 
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