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From Dave Fisher <>
Subject Re: JIRA and communities
Date Fri, 25 May 2012 18:47:40 GMT

On May 25, 2012, at 10:32 AM, Ralph Goers wrote:

> On May 25, 2012, at 8:37 AM, Benson Margulies wrote:
>> On Fri, May 25, 2012 at 12:53 AM, Steve Loughran
>> <> wrote:
>>> On 24 May 2012 06:15, Benson Margulies <> wrote:
>>>> I've met other groups of people who like a JIRA centric view
>>>> of the world. I suspect that if they did a bunch of other good things
>>>> called out below, you or others would find the JIRA business
>>>> digestible. Also, on the other hand, I fear that the co-employed
>>>> contributors are collaborating in the hallway, and the lack of the
>>>> context in JIRA or on the list is contributing to the problem.
>>> I'm not convinced that JIRA helps communities. It's great in companies -IDE
>>> integration, you can bounce issues to others, it pings your phone so often
>>> you can use it as a network liveness test. It also lets you persist
>>> discussions in a way that can be searched. In a busy project, it helps you
>>> keep track of your workload, and can assist in sprint planning if you fill
>>> in the est/actual workload fields.
>> I don't claim that JIRA helps, but I also don't accept the proposition
>> that JIRA hurts.
>> I think that we should focus on the community, not the tools. The
>> JIRA-oriented projects I follow have JIRA set to send all new issues,
>> and all new comments, to the dev list. So all community members, and,
>> in particular, all PMC members with a duty to supervise, see all the
>> traffic.
> I have no problem with Jira, it is a great tool.  My problem - specific to the way Flume
does things - is that they also use the Review tool and you end up with a copy of a message
from the Review tool and another copy of the same thing from Jira.  A LOT of those messages
are pure noise.  The ones that do contain content do a poor job of quoting whatever is being
commented on.  So the only way to really tell what is going on is to go into Jira and look
at every issue.  

In my quick review yesterday in the ML, it really was difficult. The combination between Review
and JIRA is worse than getting non-html COnfluence notifications which don't diff. You cannot
know what is going on without the other tools.

Bugzilla and JIRA notifications by themselves aren't too bad, at least these are incremental.
It really is hard not to think that all the work is being done in JIRA and ReviewBoard and
not on the ML. This makes oversight difficult.


> Ralph
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