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From Benson Margulies <>
Subject JIRA and communities
Date Fri, 25 May 2012 15:37:54 GMT
On Fri, May 25, 2012 at 12:53 AM, Steve Loughran
<> wrote:
> On 24 May 2012 06:15, Benson Margulies <> wrote:
>> I've met other groups of people who like a JIRA centric view
>> of the world. I suspect that if they did a bunch of other good things
>> called out below, you or others would find the JIRA business
>> digestible. Also, on the other hand, I fear that the co-employed
>> contributors are collaborating in the hallway, and the lack of the
>> context in JIRA or on the list is contributing to the problem.
> I'm not convinced that JIRA helps communities. It's great in companies -IDE
> integration, you can bounce issues to others, it pings your phone so often
> you can use it as a network liveness test. It also lets you persist
> discussions in a way that can be searched. In a busy project, it helps you
> keep track of your workload, and can assist in sprint planning if you fill
> in the est/actual workload fields.

I don't claim that JIRA helps, but I also don't accept the proposition
that JIRA hurts.

I think that we should focus on the community, not the tools. The
JIRA-oriented projects I follow have JIRA set to send all new issues,
and all new comments, to the dev list. So all community members, and,
in particular, all PMC members with a duty to supervise, see all the

Meanwhile, some projects, with or without JIRA, just creep along
making small, incremental, changes and bugfixes. There's no grand
strategy or vision, and, as a result, not much to talk about most of
the time. Bugs and requests come in and people deal with them -- or

So, I won't claim that your disfunction scenario is impossible or
never observed at the ASF. I will point out that bugzilla could be
used just as effectively to create the same problem.

As a mentor, what I care about is what happens when a new person shows
up. Does the dev list manage to welcome and encourage that person? Or
does that person find a mysterious, opaque situation in which there
seems to be a secret code that has to be broken to get a contribution

If welcome and encouragement amounts to 'go find a JIRA and get busy,'
that does not bother me, so long it leads to the happy result of
applied patches and eventual karma.

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