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From Joe Schaefer <joe_schae...@yahoo.com>
Subject Re: Small but otherwise happy podlings
Date Wed, 11 Jan 2012 18:52:48 GMT
I hate the fact that these discussions continue to happen in a vacuum
devoid of any grasp of the reality that mentors typically don't do
a fucking thing for their podlings.  No they don't discuss reports
on list, nor do they offer opinions on how to grow a smallish podling's
committer base, nor do they bother to sign reports even tho we have
repeatedly requested they do so.

There are over a DOZEN unsigned reports RIGHT NOW in the current month's
reports.  If you bother to do any research to see if those podlings have
had any dev-list discussion about it, you will be disappointed.  Reports
are treated as a bureaucratic formality that nobody bothers to read. Period.



----- Original Message -----
> From: Ross Gardler <rgardler@opendirective.com>
> To: general@incubator.apache.org
> Cc: antelder@apache.org; Joe Schaefer <joe_schaefer@yahoo.com>
> Sent: Wednesday, January 11, 2012 7:05 AM
> Subject: Re: Small but otherwise happy podlings
> 
> On 10 January 2012 22:03, Marcel Offermans <marcel.offermans@luminis.nl> 
> wrote:
>>  Whilst I agree there is value in demonstrating a starting podling what a 
> good report
>>  should look like by doing it for them, I also strongly believe in learning 
> by doing, so I
>>  would still propose that a podling has a go at it themselves, before having 
> a mentor step
>>  in. In the end, this is also a question of "mentoring style" and 
> I think we should leave
>>  that up to the mentors and podlings.
>> 
>>  A mentor should be actively involved in the discussion about the report 
> though, ensuring
>>  that the end result is good.
> 
> +1 a mentoring role is one of guiding not doing. I don't support
> mentors writing reports for podlings. I expect that at least one
> mentor is involved in the writing of those reports.
> 
> If people want to ask mentors to comment on reports when they sign off
> that's fine, but if you ever see that I've signed off on a report it
> means that I have at least read the thread that produced the report
> and might have already commented on it on the dev lists. Isn't that
> how it should be?
> 
> Do mentors sign off on reports they don't agree with? I hope not. If
> not then all we need to do is ensure the mentors themselves are
> capable of writing better reports.
> 
> Ross
> 
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