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From Leo Simons <>
Subject Re: Apache Incubator Proposal: Splitting the Community?
Date Fri, 03 Jun 2011 19:33:32 GMT
On Fri, Jun 3, 2011 at 7:17 PM, Jim Jagielski <> wrote:
>> Just remember, we haven't yet even voted on whether or not to accept
>> the podling.
>> These are decisions the podling should be making.
> Are you ready to call for a vote? :)

Whoah! Please don't call for a vote -- I would much rather we first
arrive at a situation where I can comfortably vote +1! :)

I recognize that all important smiley (note I'm adding smileys too!!
(^_^) ), but let's pretend I'm ignoring that, in which case for me the
actual answer is something like...

* The, err, awkward language in the proposal that was pointed out [1]
should be fixed first.

* Arguably you need _at least_ 3 mentors first.

* There is a ton of information/opinions/plans/background on
blogs/twitter/press releases/etc (for example from IBM folks like Rob)
that is not quite reflected yet in the proposal, which should change:
the proposal should be complete so that you can read it from start to
end, have a good idea about everything going on, and cast a vote.

* There is a ton of stuff at (infrastructure, docs,
...) for which it is unclear what ASF its relation is going to be to
it, the proposal is not quite reflecting the reality of what OOo is

* You reached out to a bunch of organisations and existing communities
and asked them to provide feedback and/or sign up as committers, and
we have mostly not seen the response yet. I'm sure many people are
still trying to get to grips with what is happening.

* There are some conversations going on that seem a bit heated now but
also seem pretty resolvable. It seems a good idea to get rid of most
of that heat before voting on the next step.

* In general I see a couple of very excited people generating a lot of
e-mail traffic which means a not so great signal-to-noise ratio (which
is normal and fine and such, this is _huge_ for a lot of people :-) ),
making it very hard for people that have to vote on a proposal to get
a clear hold of the signal. Making having a very clear and complete
proposal (perhaps even with FAQ) even more important.


I'm not much of a process junkie, but I think the whole idea of OOo
coming here also includes following normal apache due diligence
processes, which tends to involve slowing things down a bit when they
get heated up. I personally completely fail to get excited about
office applications (but welcome on board guys! Good luck! :-) ) but
you're pretty obviously not done with some of the basics yet. The
responsible vote AFAICS right now would be something like "-1, seems
like a good idea, but the proposal is not finished, so please fix it".



[1] "Oracle and ASF agree [broad statement]"... "IBM as Sponsor" ... etc

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