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From Greg Stein <>
Subject Re: Insanity. Apache Incubator should be about education (was: [PROPOSAL][VOTE] Subversion)
Date Mon, 09 Nov 2009 16:05:42 GMT
On Mon, Nov 9, 2009 at 10:53, Andrus Adamchik <> wrote:
> On Nov 9, 2009, at 5:23 PM, Greg Stein wrote:
>> I mean, really... how many other projects that are 9.5 years old(*) do
>> we expect to see arriving here? And of those, how many *started* with
>> the ideas and precepts of the Apache Software Foundation? I suspect it
>> will be zero, so wasting a lot of time documenting (rather than
>> recognizing) exceptions might not be very useful.
> There were a few mature projects. Not as large as SVN, but still pretty old
> (say 5 years of track record) and with established community and market
> position. Essentially in the same category (maybe sans the ubiquity of SVN).

Yup. I definitely know about SpamAssassin. Not sure how old that
project is, but I do know they started under a different model and
license (they actually had to leave some code behind because a
contributor refused to relicense (ugh!!)).

My point was primarily, "this is a very rare event. whether it needs
little or a lot of help, large/old contributions are going to need
*different* treatment."

>> But I say "as appropriate". Sometimes it just doesn't make sense to
>> document every possible exception. But simply to note *they can
>> exist*.
> Agreed. Just that nobody else was able to get a waiver to date, and this was
> likely because people coming in were intimidated into thinking they have no
> other way, but follow the procedure. So unfortunately there is (and likely
> will be) a difference in treatment. I guess that's a social issue, not a
> procedural one (i.e. insider vs. outsider perception).

Yah. I think you're very right on that.

It may also be that my "Request for Waiver" concept will provide a
mechanism for other podlings in the future. They may be granted, or
they may be denied, but it could provide an avenue to query whether a
particular procedure really should be applied in the same way for
their situation.


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