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From "Aidan Skinner" <>
Subject Re: Allow incubator releases? [was: way too wordy]
Date Mon, 06 Oct 2008 10:18:54 GMT
On Mon, Oct 6, 2008 at 8:22 AM, Niclas Hedhman <> wrote:

>   * Not accept podlings to release code. Possibly having the "final
> act" of the podling to do a release, which effectuates the graduation.
> I am Ok with either of these, since I think that downstream users
> ain't stupid and more capable than I think we give them credit for.

Not being able to release code from the incubator will have one or more of
three effects:

1) podlings will find building a community massively more difficult.

2) podlings will push releases through non-ASF routes, bypassing the IPMC
entirely. Some projects are already doing this due to not being able to push
to central.

3) potential podlings will ignore the incubator and the ASF entirely.

The first will prolong a podlings stay in the incubator due to diversity
issues. The second will stop podlings getting experience with things like
LICENSE, NOTICE etc, which are surprisingly difficult to get right. The
third is just undesireable.

As for making the incubator a less comfortable place for podlings, waiting
weeks to get a new committer approved and almost a month for a release to be
approved are pretty uncomfortable experiences for a project.

They are also things which actively hinder a project graduating. The focus
seems to be on finding bigger, stickier sticks.

Perhaps a more effective approach would be, as suggested elsewhere, to
require a podling to report on it's progress towards graduation in the board
reports. If unsatisfactory progress is being made, then the mentors should
get involved.

If that isn't sufficent, perhaps podlings should not use the Apache brand in
supporting materials? Changing code layout, distribution channels etc is a
substantial amount of work, but having to refer to it as Frobnicator instead
of Apache Frobnicator gives some incentive to podlings without imposing an
additional burden on them.

- Aidan
Apache Qpid - World Domination through Advanced Message Queueing
"Nine-tenths of wisdom consists in being wise in time." - Theodore Roosevelt

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