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From "Alex Karasulu" <>
Subject Re: Mentors and members (was: Re: Mentors On IPMC [WAS Re: [Vote] RCFproposal (was: [Proposal] RCF - a rich component library for JSF)])
Date Sun, 15 Apr 2007 13:33:36 GMT

On 4/11/07, Noel J. Bergman <> wrote:
> Alex Karasulu wrote:
> > William A. Rowe, Jr. wrote:
> > > ASF members -do- have additional insights from private forums, and the
> > > ability to oversee most of the private forums at the ASF.  This means
> > > they can (and do) go back to the archives to look back at how a
> specific
> > > issue (people issues, company issues, legal issues) were addressed in
> > > similar cases to help guide a podling away from trouble.
> >
> > I've done this several times and it proved to be a valuable asset to me
> > as a mentor.
> But not an invaluable one that you could not perform the task
> without.  But
> this is why we had previously compromised on ensuring that at least one
> Mentor is an ASF Member.
> > > They also have made their mark on the Foundation (which is why they
> are
> > > members).  That gives me a bit of reassurance that our mentors have
> less
> > > to prove, and can help guide the project from 10,000 feet rather than
> in
> > > the trenches, where egos can get in the way.
> > I was opposed to your line of thought until I read this paragraph.  This
> is
> > a very important point I did not consider before.
> And very disrespectful to those who have admirably performed the Mentor
> role
> without having something to prove.  Becoming a Member does not grant some
> magic insight.  It is often the other way around: those who demonstrate it
> become Members.
> > I think I would agree with you now that mentors should be ASF members
> > although IPMC members need not be ASF members.
> Oh?  So people wo are not qualified to be a Mentor, should still be
> permitted to make binding decisions regarding the Incubator and all its
> projects?

I see your point here as well.  This is an anomaly yes.  I'm not saying this
is a perfect
solution and perhaps I'm wrong.  Bill just swayed me a bit with his last
comment about
being able to access these private archives.  I just think these materials
are useful.  No
disrespect towards those who were not members and did the job properly.  I
agree that
there are no magic powers to being a member ... just greater awareness of
what's going
on internally because of access to these private archives.

I can see both sides of this argument and am torn between either direction.
Really I think
regardless of the direction we go the ASF is going to be OK.  Either option
will be managed
with diligence from our membership and our supporters.


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