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From Leo Simons <>
Subject Re: Mentors and members
Date Thu, 12 Apr 2007 19:37:18 GMT
On Apr 10, 2007, at 8:33 PM, William A. Rowe, Jr. wrote:
> Bottom line, what is the *motivation* to have non-ASF-member  
> Mentorships?

We need all the help we can get.

There's many people that volunteer to fill this mentoring role. Most  
of them do a good job. They may not always be Members. There is no  
correlation between doing a good job mentoring and being a Member,  
and the postulation of a correlation is offensive without relevant data.

We have always allowed for non-Member mentors and it has never caused  
an issue.

It's healthy for any community ecosystem to be as diverse as  
possible. The ASF tries to be as open as possible, and this involves  
putting as few barriers to participation as possible.

And such and so forth.

Most importantly, its a proven recipe that has yet to fail us.

> So please give me some valid cases for this exception

No, that's the wrong way around. We made an initial policy, it has  
worked in the past, it is working, and it has helped to resulted in  
positive contributions to the ASF, and satisfies our basic openness  
criteria. It should stay the way it is until there is a good reason  
to change it. So far, I haven't seen that reason being brought up.

> other than "but they are ready!"  I don't care that they might
> be ready - I'm asking for examples of motivation, and predictably  
> positive
> outcomes from non-member mentorship.

How about you provide a predictably positive outcome from from-Member  
mentorship first?

> Mentorship isn't technical

Some of it is.

> it's entire purpose is to convey "this is the ASF" to a podling.

No that's not the purpose of mentorship. The purpose of mentorship is  
to help guide a new or existing open source community into the ASF in  
a way that is good for both them and the ASF. (tangent: to me, the  
most interesting of those communities are the ones that make the ASF  
change its ways.)

> It's silly to suggest non-ASF members can or should be that voice.

No, it isn't. I will assert there are many more non-Members that can  
do that job well (and are willing to do it) than there are Members  
that can do it well (and are willing to do it). I've been a Member  
for long enough now and a Mentor several times know, and I will  
assert there is very little it brings you that allows you to do a  
good job at Mentoring.


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