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From "Jacek Laskowski" <>
Subject Re: OpenEJB as TLP [was;[proposal] OpenEJB Graduation Proposal]
Date Tue, 03 Apr 2007 10:24:06 GMT
On 4/3/07, Niclas Hedhman <> wrote:

> IIUIC, both Hibernate and Kodo builds EJB3 & (Hibernate|JDO) on top of the JPA
> layers in the same product.

Hibernate != EJB 3.0 whereas JBoss AS 4/5 + EJB 3.0 profile == EJB 3.0.

Hibernate EntityManager is a JPA provider as Apache OpenJPA and
TopLink Essentials and Cayenne partially. Hibernate is a foundation
for Hibernate EntityManager.

AFAIK, Kodo is a commercial product based on OpenJPA + some JDO stuff.

So, no EJB 3.0 exists in the products mentioned - Hibernate and Kodo.
EJB 3.0 is more than (merely ;-)) JPA.

> So you are saying that somewhere down the line we could have a "ménage à
> trois" TLP constellation of OpenJPA -> OpenEJB -> Geronimo?

Sort of. Geronimo is a Java EE application server, so with some work,
one could think of any EJB 3.0 container embedded in Geronimo
(OpenEJB, EasyBeans from ObjectWeb, JBoss EJB, etc.). Another question
is how these EJB 3.0 containers support the spec, esp.  JPA. Whether
they rely on their own containers or leverage what's available on the
market. OpenEJB relies on OpenJPA. Since JPA introduces a concept of
"outside the container", i.e. there's no need to have a full blown
application server to run JPA apps, I could easily imagine a scenario
where OpenJPA -> Geronimo or OpenJPA alone. All mixtures are possible,
even partial EJB 3.0 support without JPA.

Thanks for the phrase 'ménage à trois'! Never heard of it.

> Ok, cool... I mostly want to hear that there is a cross-community
> communication and collaboration going on, and the ties are in healthy
> condition.

Sure! You ask we provide ;-) Take a look at the OpenJPA archives where
Dain (Apache OpenEJB/Geronimo committer) cooperate with OpenJPA
community. There are many JPA stuff in OpenEJB and Geronimo archives,

I think it's very healthy, but there can be more and will be. AFAIUI,
the only factor that prevent us from extending our collaboration is
time. OpenEJB'd been lucky lately and the team of committers grew up a
little. We expect more to come once Geronimo 2.0 hits the shelves.


Jacek Laskowski

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