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From Andrew Clark <>
Subject Re: ajax proposal?
Date Tue, 24 Jan 2006 19:00:23 GMT
Raphaƫl Luta wrote:
> I completely understand that you're not a toolkit company
> however I can't understand why the AjaxTk is currently in
> such a sore open-source state:
> - the code dumps on the site are not functional out of the
>   box

To be precise, all of the toolkit (widgets, utils, etc)
are completely functional. It's the infrastructure for
the samples that need some work to make them work out 
of the box.

> - no source control access

We have read-only CVS access[1] already for the entire
project. The details should definitely be more visible,
though. I'll talk to someone about getting it more
prominent on the main site.

> I understand that you wouldn't want to setup your own public
> dev infrastructure but using, codehaus, tigris or
> whatever public infra wouldn't have been very onerous.
> My concern here is if no resources have been dedicated
> so far to really build the AjaxTk into an OSS project why
> would that change once it is in incubation ?

Let me try to summarize what I think your point is and
you can tell me if I'm wrong. You would feel better
about the submission if it were already a fully formed
OSS project on an external site with full development
infrastructure and long-time active community. Is this

It seems to me that if that were the case, then there
would be little need to come to the Apache incubator
with all the extra work and headaches of the process.
There are certainly projects that seem to be natural
extensions to Apache and thus, as someone put it,
"come home". But most fully-formed projects would have
little need to come to Apache so I would be wary of
them wanting the Apache brand.

In this case, the Kabuki submission is an attempt to
help kickstart the AJAX movement at Apache. And we're
willing to work on that with other members of the
community. But being in the Apache incubator certainly
doesn't help us; it's actually a loss when you consider
the time and resources that are taken away from our
core business. And we're not doing it for the press 
'cause that's simply not allowed until after a project 
exits incubation which could be years down the road.

Anyway, we've probably had enough discussion and should
just vote this up or down. If you feel that strongly
about it, you can vote your -1 veto. Your other option
is to let it pass but lodge your disapproval with a -0.


Andy Clark * Zimbra *

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