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From Niclas Hedhman <>
Subject Re: The Incubator and Infrastructure
Date Sat, 03 Sep 2005 06:57:11 GMT
On Saturday 03 September 2005 02:56, Leo Simons wrote:
> What *is* your intention? Are you helping us out here? How?

In 2003, I was signing up for the infra@ list, on the basis of "I think I 
should really try to help out there, since it is what makes ASF tick."
The message was essentially, hang around and you will get the "feel for it" 
and eventually be able to help out.

Now, although I have a lot of stupid habits (like not shutting up when I 
should), I don't consider myself an average idiot and normally pick stuff up 
fairly easily. But not in this case. Some of that I account to "no read 
access" to many resources, so when someone says "To do X, you need to bla bla 
bla..." in 9 out of 10 cases, it is not possible to "review" what the details 
actually is referring to, making the learning process so much harder.

Finally, I gave up. You managed, I didn't. Fine, I can live with that.

"Recruitment" was a word that Erik found "interesting", but I still claim that 
infra@ must be better at recruiting volunteers. The bar is too high, and 
recruitment suffers. My argument is that part of the "high bar" is that most 
services are fairly tucked away out of view for the average committer who 
wants to help. Hence learning the setup of any particular service, is more 
difficult than needed.

Last thing;
Infra@ is asking for more help. When asked for "help with what?", things 
becomes vague. Specifics often requires root access, which is not the 
intention of the original request.

My advice (among others); Make a short and specific list of what the average 
committer can do, to make a difference for the infra@ team. Better yet, break 
it up to invidual items, put them in JIRA under some understood "component". 
If it is a "tool" to be made, then make the entire committer base developers, 
so they can "assign" the issue and mark progress. And don't be vague like 
"integrate X with Y" which for everyone outside(!) makes no sense.


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