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From Jason van Zyl <>
Subject Re: [VOTE] Re: request for incubation: axion database project
Date Thu, 18 Dec 2003 18:22:04 GMT
On Thu, 2003-12-18 at 13:14, Sander Striker wrote:
> On Thu, 2003-12-18 at 18:57, Jason van Zyl wrote:
> > On Thu, 2003-12-18 at 11:28, Rodney Waldhoff wrote:
> > 
> > > ----------------------------------------
> > > Ballot 2:
> > > ----------------------------------------
> > > Since Axion is to be a sub-project of the Apache DB project and is
> > > currently comprised of long standing ASF members and committers, and since
> > > some members of the Incubator PMC have recently expressed an interest in
> > > only incubating what is to become top level projects,
> I still don't get where this came from.

It came from pure frustration from the fact that *nothing* ever gets
done here. What are the PMCs for anyway? Why can't they vet the code for
whatever reason because that's who ends up doing it in the incubator
anyway. Everything else is a distraction.

> [...]
> > The only thing that could really present a problem is the legal stuff,
> > after that let it go. If the PMC decides the projects sucks  for
> > whatever reason then it can toss it out. If a project wants to go TLP
> > then let them (I don't care anymore, users will ultimately decide what
> > is shit and what isn't) and if it's a big flop then kick them out. The
> > Incubator is a morass and big hinderance to getting anything done.
> You're taking this a bit too lightly.  A TLP will have a Chair who
> will be a V.P. of the foundation.  A V.P. can sign documents on
> behalf of the foundation, etc.

C'mon dude, it's not like the proposed PMC chair is coming out of the
blue. If we don't know who this is already or we don't know the
responsible member well enough then what the hell do we have?

I don't want people nobody knows to walk in and become an officer of the
board but someone has to know these people coming in. Ultimately we are
trusting the people involved with the project anyway. Do you know any of
the Geronimo people personally? Or the Ruper people? Probably not, I
know I don't. So if we don't trust the people interested in bringing the
code in then we don't have anything anyway.

> Sander
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Jason van Zyl

In short, man creates for himself a new religion of a rational
and technical order to justify his work and to be justified in it.
  -- Jacques Ellul, The Technological Society

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