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From Jochen Theodorou <>
Subject Re: About Gradle, Kotlin and Inner Fear
Date Mon, 23 May 2016 11:38:46 GMT
On 23.05.2016 10:59, Thibault Kruse wrote:
> Cedric's comment linked at the bottom of that post is excellent in
> describing the issue. The gradle DSL has been designed in a way that is
> hard to support by IDEs, partly because groovy made that so easy.
> And the same might be true about other popular groovy frameworks. Having
> to support plugins for each IDE for each framework specific DSL is not
> viable.
> If there were a lesson to be learned here for a vastly different groovy
> 3, it is hard to imagine that in practice those lessons could be applied.

The lesson would be to have static typed DSLs, and if you want to be 
language implementation agnostic, you need the description in something 
anyone can read. So the maximum that is allowed is annotations of some 
kind - or a DSL to describe the DSL.

The later exists, is called GDSL, and even though IDE specific, it is 
not very well supported by the same IDEs.

And what we have in first possibility might be on par with many other 
DSL supporting languages, but not working out well enough for Gradle. 
That is, if you want to keep the DSL as is.

I am wondering more about something like this:

So if that basically means adding new DSL parts to any arbitrary (but 
ExtensionAware) element in the build system. Then you need to define a 
way to connect that in a static way for a static view to be able to do 
static checks. I guess that would be extension functions then.. The 
difference between their extension functions and our extension methods 
is, that theirs is potentially more easy to use, since you do not need 
to produce a descriptor. There was never really a need for that so far 
in Groovy, but it certainly could be implemented. The static compiler 
already understands extension methods, so it would be just a matter of a 
different descriptor of some kind, plus making that available at compile 

I really would like to see a gradle DSL example in Kotlin that cannot 
made static checked in Groovy. Because things like accessing dynamic 
properties won´t work in Kotlin as well.

If they really wanted to there would be a way.

bye Jochen

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