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From "Stephane Bailliez" <>
Subject Re: death of a mutant
Date Fri, 12 Jul 2002 19:03:34 GMT
----- Original Message -----
From: "Steve Loughran" <>

> yeah, ant-dev has #3 traffic count on the nagoya archive; it is
> institutionalised that it will be hard to move people from ant1 to ant2.

I don't think that the traffic in the dev list can be used this way...I
think that someone in commons or general did a deeper analysis between #
messages and unique senders and committers indicating projects with a very
high development activity and few users.

> to Java1.2+
> -----------
> Regarding a move to Ant1.2, je m'en fous about running on MSJVM or J#, and
> indeed J# actually adds collections, and maybe even
> so maybe Don box will be able to run ant on the CLR after all (*), though
> course we will respond to all support calls related to the CLR to nous
> nous'en fous (DD, Stephane correct?).

"on s'en fout" or "nous nous en foutons" first one being more appropriate in
this case.
( for non french speaking people : "we don't give a sh*" )

> -The fact that there are bugs related to <java> on MSJVM that we have
> fixed because nobody ever reported them, shows that that is not a popular
> platform.

MSJVM still kicks ass in performance after years but let's face it it's not
widely used in a professional development environment...

> We had always said that Ant 2.0 would be Java1.2, even 12+ months ago when
> it was specced. Maybe it is time to move the Ant to Java1.2, even if that
> means we have to call it version 2.  We still need to be able to build
> 1.1 (and should test for that), even though we dont build *on* 1.1.

Yes I think that's the main point.

We must be able to separate the libs used to run Ant than the one needed by
the user.
A couple of things are not very correct to me, mainly for example <javac>
includeantruntime which defaults to yes... this is obviouslly very bad
practice that has been there forever and is fundamentally WRONG.

Much water has flowed under the bridges since Ant 2 first has
been good not to hurry and jump into Ant2.


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