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From Stefan Bodewig <>
Subject Re: JARs in CVS (was Re: On voting rules)
Date Wed, 29 Nov 2000 08:48:04 GMT
I hope you don't mind me switching subject lines back and force but in
"On voting rules" I'm asking a question on the rules in general. And I
don't want to lose focus on this question there.

Jon Stevens <> wrote:

> on 11/29/2000 12:09 AM, "Stefan Bodewig" <> wrote:
>> PS: In the nine months I've been following Ant development I've
>> never seen a -1 ignored or overruled and I really really hope this
>> is never going to happen.
> In this case, I personally feel that it is overruled until there is
> a good solution that resolves the issue. So far, I haven't seen one,
> but I sure as hell have proposed one.

OK, I haven't voted at all on this issue, partly because I didn't get
the opportunity to speak up before something happened (the junit.jar
had already been checked in at the time I received Peter's mail).

If I understand Pete's and your goal correctly you want to (1) make it
easy to get a development version of Ant (we're on ant-dev here and I
don't intend to talk about any other project) that works more or less
out of the box and (2) support the lazy developer - Pete's words - by
shipping as many required libraries as possible.

OK, here is my proposal: Include the JARs in the nightly builds but
leave the out of the repository. Downloading a nightly build is even
easier than building from CVS and it is a lot less work, so both
points should have been addressed.

> I'm a bit depressed at this point that absolutely no one from the
> community has volunteered to step up to the plate to help resolve
> this issue in any way. Why the fuck am I trying to help people out
> in this community if there is no community to help support us when
> we need help? :-(

(1) What you have proposed (the CJAN idea, right?) has some connection
to Ant, but I personally see it as something separate. I guess your
proposal would have better been placed at general@jakarta or something
similar. This is not really an Ant or even "Ant only" thing. You are
not addressing the right community IMHO.

(2) Conor said he liked the idea and was willing to help. Stating that
"absolutely no one from the community has volunteered to step up" is

(3) In my experience "there is no community to help support us when we
need help" is plain wrong as a general statement - at least for the
Ant community. For the CJAN case, see (1).

> I even tried to get things started by making a proposal someone
> could start to implement.  I'm sorry, I have to much other stuff on
> my plate right now to write everyone's software for them.

I know you are a very active guy, contributing to a lot of projects,
but - don't get me wrong - you're not the only one being busy with
other things.

> So, if everyone disagrees with my overrule, I will remove all the
> .jar's from CVS,

Remember we've been talking about Ant, we still are on ant-dev. I
can't remember you committing any JAR at all and if the Turbine
community decides they'd prefer to have the JAR in there CVS, fine.


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