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From Jose Alberto Fernandez <>
Subject RE: Using old ant.jar in build.bat?
Date Tue, 11 Jul 2000 01:22:01 GMT
> From: Conor MacNeill []
> >[....]
> > If the Apache experience is any good example, a lot of people
> > download the sources and compile them themselves even though
> > they have no plans what so ever of modifying the code.
> > Why would it be ten times more difficult for these people than
> > for those downloading the binaries only?
> >
> Jose,
> If you download an Apache module, do you expect it to include 
> the Apache
> source code necessary to build it? To build the module you 
> have to put all
> the pieces in place. As another example look at
> Would you expect all of these 
> libraries to be
> in PHP's CVS tree? My point is that for many things you 
> install and build on
> your system there are dependencies which you need to satisfy.

The analogy is not correct, the case of an Apache module (in my opinion)
is equivalent to that of an optional task. And I do not expect having
ANT shipped with every optional tag that someone may have written.

My only problem is with the parts of ANT that are required for ANT
to work at all. I.e., jaxp.jar et al. Notice that ANT ships xml.jar
with it and therefore is added to the classpath as part of the ANT script
on the other hand, JAXP is not becase the script does not know where
it may be installed. If we knew it will always be present in ant/lib
then they could be added transparently. And the CLASSPATH would be left

Notice that, for different reasons, in NT(all Windowze?) and in csh the size
of the CLASSPATH has a limit. Hence I want to keep as much as 
possible out of it.

> If a sysadmin decided to install and build ant themselves I 
> would expect
> them to read the ant documentation.
>     System Requirements
>       To build and use ant you must have a JAXP compliant
>       XML parser installed and available on your classpath.

If I have xerces, do I still need jaxp.jar from Javasoft? Or is
it xerces.jar all I need? For some reason I thought jaxp.jar was required
no mater what parser yu wanted to use. Do I need to set something 
additional to make ANT use xerces?

>       If you do not have a JAXP compliant XML parser installed,
>       you may use the reference implementation available from Sun.
>       It is available from Once installed
>       make sure the "jaxp.jar" and "parser.jar" files are in your
>       classpath.
>       You will also need the JDK installed on your system,
>       version 1.1 or later.
> Is this "ten times more difficult"?
> BTW I put this section into the doco so people would be aware of the
> dependencies. It probably needs to be updated in light of the 
> bundling of
> the jaxp stuff with the binary distribution. If this section 
> is not a good
> idea, let us know and we can change it. Also, in the future it should
> probably point people to Xerxes.

YES, if that is all that is needed. I jar is better than 2.

> Thoughts?
> Conor

I understand from Ruby's message the problem of version maintainability
by having fix versions of other projects in ANT's source control.
But I guess there has to be an intermediate arangement that is easy
and simple. That's all I ask.

Jose Alberto

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